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shawn
Moderator
91 Posts |
 Posted - 07/28/2010 : 11:39:59 AM
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I just got off the phone with a very good buddy of mine. He served in the military with me and is a fellow sufferer of PTSD.He was on all kind of pysch meds and was on valium for a little over a year. Comming of the V landed him in a hospital for a loong time.
He currently lives in Colorado. Now Im not trying to stir up on hornets nest but his dr. had him aply for a med marijuana card, and perscribes him an indica strain on MJ to relieve his anxiety and help with sleep. He has been doing this for over 6 months now. While no longer in the military of course. He told me today, he is now holding a steady job for a while now, and still struggles with anxiety from time to time, but swares this has made all the diff to him.
He told me you have to be careful as some marijuana (sativa strains) can make anxiety worse..but the kind he gets LEGALLY is the relaxing kind.
Morally I am not to sure sbout this, but if it helps..there has got to be something behind this. I would much rather smoke than be on pills to help with my anxiety.
I am just posting this, not as a pro MJ post AT ALL, or a CON..just trying to see how others feel about this issue.
Once the benzo's are out of our lives for some of us the issues are still going to remain. whether it be anxiety, PTSD, or whatever..for some people those issues will not remain.
But for those that it does, do you guys feel this is a bad thing, good thing, or what other ways of dealing with anxiety or PTSD have others here sought. I cannot afford years and years of therapy. the Va hospital is the first one to put me on benzo's and I found thier help very lacking to say the least.
I now work behind a desk, with computers. I chose this as I dont have to see many different people daily..the ones I do see are usualy the same ones. We have a person on our team that deals with new clients, and is more or less the people person of our team..but I still deal with certain issues on a daily basis that make it to where I dont even want to close my eyes some nights.
If it's ok, Can we get a discussion going about this, since it is a way some deal with anxiety now, and is legal in a lot of states and the states continue to grow every year it seems. I know my state has been dicussing and studying it for sometime now.
How do others feel about this, as a way of dealing with the issues that led us to the addicting pills? if those issues return after we are off of the pills?
Again this is by NO MEANS meant as a pro pot post, or a CON pot post..I just am curious how others feel about the issue. It seems so many are afraid to discuss this. I am just very concerned that my issues are going to remain after the pills.
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Edited by - shawn on 07/28/2010 11:45:01 AM |
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Jean
New Member
20 Posts |
Posted - 07/28/2010 : 12:11:41 PM
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Shawn, this is something I think a lot about-I was put on K for panic attacks and not sure how I will handle them once I'm off. Don't know about MJ-smoke a little when I was younger but not in a long time. I know some will say it's just substituting one crutch for another-and maybe so-but like you, how do we handle the problems we had that we were prescribed benzos for? Would like to hear others take on this.
Jean |
1 mg. Klonopin. Gradually updosed over last 12 years. Originally taken for panic attacks. |
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John
Moderator
850 Posts |
Posted - 07/28/2010 : 2:36:06 PM
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Hi Jean and Shawn,
This is a question I often ask myself too. What will happen to me when I do manage to be benzo free. I definitely don't want to get off benzos just to start another pill.
I am looking into the possibility of natural remedies such as certain herbs and herbals essences. The health food store sells a variety of different "relaxation" compounds for instance.
As far as Marijuana is concerned I can't take it anymore. I smoked it for years. First thing in the morning till lights out in the evening. Since I started taking blood pressure meds I just can't smoke it anymore as it gives me a horrible effect. Also for those with a tendency toward Derealization or depersonalization it can greatly aggravate those conditions.
All I ever gained from "therapy" was some personal insight into what a "rascal" I really was. LOL! Though some seem to be helped by cognitive therapy in addressing day to day problems. I went for the "depth analysis" approach.
The truth of the matter is that many people who began taking a benzo for some particular psychological problem find that once they become benzo free Following a gentle gradual reduction method like the one Jana has developed) the psycho-dynamics that were initially causing the problem seems to have been altered and the problem isn't there anymore. (that is of course assuming one is taking a benzo for its' anti anxiety effect) There are many reasons why this may be the case, so I would keep a wait and see attitude. That is what I am trying to do. And I have been taking sedative relaxing drugs like opiates barbiturates and benzos for almost forty years. Mostly benzos over the last 25.
I know many people that smoke pot to relax, but they have never been dependent upon benzos nor have they suffered any form of "benzo illness." So I don't have any data to draw upon for how effective it might be for former benzo dependent users. I have known a few alcoholics ( or heavy drinkers) that quit drinking and took up smoking the "medicine" and that seemed to work as a sort of substitute for the booze. Of course I recognize that there may be a significant difference between a "free choice drinker" and a benzo victim who became dependent simply taking as prescribed.
I guess my advice, if I may be so bold as to offer any, is a wait and see approach. You may find that after you are free of the benzos that somewhere in the process of getting free things have changed for you
and you have developed other coping mechanisms for dealing with your panic or anxiety, depression etc.
Sincerely
John |
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skooter
Senior Member
370 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2010 : 02:31:46 AM
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Well since the question was asked, I guess I will pipe in here. Although I feel that being judged thing nagging at me.
I have smoked MJ off and on since I was a 17. When I came off of my anti-depressants after a decade of use, it helped me tremendously and probably saved my life quite a few times. Coming off of the antis was no picnic either, it took me 2 yrs. until I was mentally healed from those nasty things. I never had an anxiety issue, except for a couple of panic attacks which were very scary, but I was on a benzo for sleep and am sure it was caused from those.
Now, I do smoke now sometimes to calm down my horrid s/x's. I am also trying to decide if I should get my license (never bothered me before, and not sure I want to go that direction). I have the papers to fill out, maybe I am just being lazy (a huge guilty feeling I suffer with daily thanks to my s/x's being so debilitating). One thing I will say tho, is when I do have a couple small puffs, I am usually able to get somethings done. Which for me is needed so as not to self loathe about me and my condition.
Not sure this is of any help, and it's just how I cope some days. As you mentioned Shawn, yes there are different strains for different conditions. Something they didn't have yrs. ago. I am an avid believer in MJ use. NO body ever died from using MJ. AND if you don't want to smoke it, you can use it by baking with it, as a tea, etc. Many people use it this way, and it is excellent for sleep! I have also read of people using it to help them get off of benzos.
But John makes another good point about if you're able, then wait to see if the problem disappears once off the benzo. As doing this with Janas method more than likely will help you to not have any s/x's once you're finished. I think Karen and I are the rare exception so far.
It is your choice though. I am not telling you either way what to do. We all have to do what we need to, to get thru this. And I know in my heart that I will be off of the pills one day, and will NEVER go back to them again!
Love Cheryl |
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Jana
Administrator
1549 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2010 : 04:31:28 AM
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We have no problem with engaging in full discussion of drugs. Sometimes drugs are necessary to prevent further harm. However, drugs do not just do one thing. They have multiple effects such as therapeutic(desired) effect) and side effects( undesirable or simply irritating effect). In addition, drugs that produce the same effect are obviously going to add to that effect. This is the additive quality.
When using any drug for a while, normal chemical processes may "move over" or change to accommodate that drug. This seems to be one of the ways that benzos harm.
I am concerned with benzo metabolism. Some substances will speed the clearance of benzos. This causes an increase in withdrawal severity. Pot seems to do the opposite. From what I found, it may make the benzo remain in the body longer. It is metabolized by CYP 3A4 as well as other CYP's. It could ease benzo-caused anxiety by making the benzo remain in the body longer.
Now smoking pot is a different matter. In general, smoke will increase benzo metabolism making withdrawal worse. Are there exceptions to this? Maybe it's yes, and maybe it's no. For myself, I wouldn't take any chances. Others may be willing to take the risk.
Shawn's buddy was benzo-free when he used Pot for anxiety relief. I'd consider this far safer.
I am out of my zone when talking about recreational drugs or medical Pot. Does eating Pot have the same effect as smoking it?
Any drug seems to lose effectiveness over time. We benzo-victims know that. Do we want to have to increase Pot use over time? Non-drug anxiety treatment is preferred for obvious reasons. These methods usually treat the root cause. However this does not address the agony of the here and now. Will people be able to use drugs including Pot wisely? Of course some people can.
Banning open and honest discussion may be the rule at many benzo sites. It isn't here. Thoughtful discussion and sharing of sources is a very good thing. The only restriction is promoting illegal drug use. That's not what anyone has done here.
I live in Colorado. Pot seems to be available on every corner. I found an add for a doctor to assess individual need for the prescription (give prescriptions). For one hour of work a week, an MD was to be paid $1,500. Does anyone here want to change his/her major? 
It's good to see people engaging in creative thought and in sharing insights.
Jana
Here is some CYP info:
(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T99-4MV75B9-1&_user=10&_coverDate=03%2F20%2F2007&_rdoc=1&_fmt=high&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=e9cb7c213076519a6207223eda6e158f) |
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kattklaws
Administrator
372 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2010 : 2:44:54 PM
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Very good thread indeed.
For me, I tried pot in my early years and it did nothing but give me horrendous anxiety.
However, that being said, if someone can use medical MJ and get relief from symptoms like nausea from chemo, I would support it 100%.
MJ is something you can just stop, so I am amazed when I see people all up in arms over the legalization of MJ when these poisonous benzos are perfectly legal!
Why not make benzos illegal and let the MJ smokers smoke away..........
Good discussion.
Love to all,Karen |
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skooter
Senior Member
370 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2010 : 5:18:01 PM
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Thanks for the info Jana!
I will have to investigate now, as to where I had seen the forum on medical MJ use, and those that were using it during benzo w/d. I have to admit, when I first started reading your post Jana, my stomach dropped lol. I instantly got that fear thing of being chastized for what I had said about myself! In my opinion, pot is alot safer than alcohol, nevermind the toxic poisons the docs give us! Some of the things I read about pot making a person anywhere from a schizophrenic, to a mad drug seeker simply amaze me. And are always made by a person that has no experience with it, which really ticks me off.
I am pretty sure also, that ingesting the drug does not work the same way as smoking it does! Also when a person uses it for medical purposes, they usually don't get that high either. Because they are using it on a daily basis, the effects are not the same as if you use it sparatacly (wrong sp, sorry). This is my problem is I don't use it regularly. Everyday I think I should be, and I think I have to push myself to do this to see if it will indeed help me. I would be pretty ticked at myself if I found that it could of helped me throughout this entire process.
Also, I think I should mention that it is my doc that has been pushing me for a yr. now to use this instead of the drugs. (he's finally getting just how strongly I am against those poisons!) I've just been to lazy as I continue to call myself, to do the things needed to do, and get my medical card. (this is the main reason I've yet to do it, is do I want to be on their books if ya know what I mean). I just can't make up my mind sheeeesh.
When I found out how much one is allowed to use daily, I was SHOCKED. I don't know how it is in the US, but here it is from 1 to 3 grams. Now to me that is a heck of alot of smoke. Sheeesh. So you see, those that use it daily, compared to a person that just uses once in a while, the way they're are affected is completely the opposite. (hope that makes sense). The thing that was getting me all flabergasted was trying to learn about all of the different strains there are now. Whewww, something this brain doesn't like very much, due to getting so confused!! :(
Well that's all for today on this, I hope I can get my butt in gear and find some more info on this as I don't know if I saved any of the info I had read about a yr. ago on this, and my favs are a complete mess!! |
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